BAM! Pete Holland is the power behind the excellent Woehammer blog, best known for their Top 3 Lists series. We read and recommend it – and sometimes chime in with a bit of our own commentary over there. Pete H plays Kruleboyz regularly, and since our own Pete Atkinson is on a Kruleboyz tear right now, they decided to draft up a list together. The idea is that they’ll walk through the listbuilding process and the rationale behind their choices – then each play a game with the same list against their own local opponents, and we’ll batrep that on both blogs too. Let’s get cooking.

Plastic Pete: Pete!  How the devil are you, my man?  Strong AOS blogger, strong first name.

Woehammer Pete: I’m all good fella. Thanks for having me! At least with two of us they’ll be no chance of re-pete-ing ourselves.

Plastic Pete: Ha!  So how are you feeling about Kruleboyz overall?

Woehammer Pete: I’m really excited to break them out of their box again. I think the changes they’ve made are for the better, and I can’t think of any units that don’t have a use. Even my beloved Killbow! No longer will it just sit at the back of the table as an ornament failing to do anything… I hope.

Kruleboyz now play how they appear in the lore: Kunnin’. It all works thematically and the Dirty Tricks are awesome. It’s going to keep opponents guessing as they plan their battle tactics each round. But as the round goes on and you use more tricks, they drop off and become more difficult to do. Which I assume is the intention to show the enemy adjusting to these guerilla tactics.

Plastic Pete: Could not agree more.  It’s powerful, thematic and a constantly-evolving challenge. Bang on-brand.  Now, did you have a preferred subfaction in mind?  I think it’s fair to say Skulbugz will not be missed.  Is the shooty one the new Skulbugz?

Woehammer Pete: Oh Skulbugz, in all the events I’ve covered with Woehammer, I saw that Subfaction once, though the once it did pop up it went 4-1…. Piloted by none other than Eddie Eccles at Warhammer World…

I think there is a place for the shooty one (Middul Finga), after all Boltboyz would shoot 15” instead of 12”, which as Noel said in our recent Kruleboyz review can make a huge difference. Shooting an enemy from an additional 3” away can mean they’re left with a 10” charge against you instead of 7”.

But this edition I can’t look past Light Finga. Being able to use Sneaky Sneakin’ twice a turn is huge. It opens up loads of opportunities tactically, repositioning your Boltboyz away from danger, ambushing vulnerable units.

How about yourself, Kruleboyz Klaw?

Plastic Pete: Nah, I’m actually pretty filthy on Klaw. I personally see it as the actual shooting subfaction: that’s where I’d run bulk Boltboyz (ahead of Middul Finga) for an “I can shoot you, but you can’t shoot me” skew list. But wholly 3” is just a bit too miserly for some of our base sizes – I’m gonna say that if it’s not helping to keep your Croc alive, Klaw is fundamentally not fit for purpose. 

I’m right with you on Light Finga mate, very keen on that one too. I do like Trophy Finga – any list is going to have multiple Companion weapons just by default – so I feel like it’ll always be good. But those are my top two and if you’re keen on zip zip zipping around the board, I’m with ya! 

I know some people see Light Finga as a trap, because you’ll quickly need to hit harder rolls the more you use it. And that’s fine. You don’t need to fling multiple units around every turn – it can earn its place just by turning a game with one big moment. Lock it in! 🔒

So in terms of units: How does this sound for a core to build out from? 

Sludgeraker 320

Swampcalla Shaman 120

20 Gutrippaz 340

7 Monsta Killaz 120

7 Monsta Killaz 120

6 Boltboyz 220 

That puts us on 1240 points, so 760 points to play with, plus Enhancements and Manifestations. Anything there you see as being a “Nice to have” rather than essential? Or anything you think needs to be an automatic inclusion in every list?

Woehammer Pete: That’s a great start I think. I do think that the Killbow is now almost an auto-include to deal with the many Monsters you see on the tabletop. It’s a serious thorn in their side. If it doesn’t move, it has 2 attacks hitting on 3’s Wounding on 2’s, Rend 2 and D6 Damage. But, if the target is a Monster, you up the rend to 3 and the damage is 6 flat. I’d almost include two, but that’s probably more my own personal taste than an actual recommendation. 

I’d love a Murknob to babysit the Croc, but he’s a little pricey maybe at 120pts? 

A Killaboss with Stab-grot would be pretty sweet to go with those Gutrippaz as well. Giving them an All-Out-Attack would mean they’d also benefit from Keep ‘Em in Line for +1 to wound.

I’ve always been a massive fan of Gobsprakk for Magic Denial but it can be a struggle sometimes to both keep him alive and get your investment back from him.

In short, I’d add at least a Killaboss on foot and a Killbow.

What’s your thoughts on Double Croc this edition?

Plastic Pete: Yeah, the Killbow is dominant.  A little bit of nuance here is that the flat damage 6 is a “Per Army” ability, so there’s diminishing returns to running two of them – I reckon a few Killabosses out there might be accidentally making a mistake in their own favour with that one in these early days.  Redundancy (and critical mass of firepower) are always good, but if we start with one to maximise that ability, maybe we can see where we land?

I’m happy with that Killaboss with Stab-Grot too.  Fits into Regiments nicely as a sub-hero, and since you can’t use the Sludgeraker Venom ability (Damage 2) on your opponent’s turn, that +1 to hit and wound is a good way of putting a little extra oomph behind your Strikes Last and really making it count.

I can’t be having Gobby at 380 though, sorry mate.  That’s just an insane price point for one good Unbind per battle – and it makes me sad, because I spent bloody ages painting mine.  

And in answer to your other question – yes, I’m very keen on Double Croc – you really don’t want to see that functionality shot out of your army turn 1.  His +1 Damage buff really makes the army sing: it multiplies up with the VEW Dirty Trick (resulting in 2 mortal damage on every 5+) and also adds significantly to your conventional output – Monsta Killaz with the Killaboss buff bashing out attacks at rend 1 damage 2 are certainly no longer just praying for mortals and nothing else.

For all those reasons, I’d love to see a second Croc in there if we can make it work – and if not, we can always load ours up with defensive Enhancements. There’s enough Wards and Bodyguards in our arsenal that I feel like we can cover that off well enough without spending the points on a Murknob.

So with the Killbow and the Killaboss on foot in there, we’re now on 1530 points which means 470 to play with.  I reckon our shopping list would be:

• Mirebrute Troggoth (220): An efficient and self-sufficient bruiser.  Taking D3 damage for extra attacks, then Trogg-healing it straight back up, is some Aelf-Tier bullshit.
• Second Croc (320):  He can’t buff himself, but even a small unit of Monsta Killaz takes this buff really well, so two won’t be wasted.  And equally valuable for redundancy, because they’re so bloody important to the army.  
• Second Swampcalla (120): We’ve got a great spell lore, these guys are cheap access to +1 casting and it will keep access to Manifestations online too.  I’d love two if we can make it work.
• Corpse-Rippa Vulcha (290): Stonehorn charge mortals are always fun, and the enhanced Redeploy is not to be sniffed at.  Plus he gives us some straight-line speed.  Bit spenny at his points though?
• Murknob (120): Useful.  I’d call him a “Nice to have” and if we don’t take him, maybe we could look closely at the Mork’s Eye Pebble artefact?
• Moar Gutrippaz (170 or 340): Cos Moar Boyz is Moar Better.  
• Moar Monsta Killaz (120): If we want more boots on the ground but can’t quite stretch to the 20 wounds of Gutrippaz. 50 point discount per unit (relative to their cousins) is a steal.
• Moar Dakka (110 or 220): A unit or two of MSU Boltboyz brings a bit more output and a couple of scrappy little units, who can chip away and contribute while they score BTs.
• Sloggoth (190): Run and charge, ya know?

Did I miss anything?  I reckon I’ve spent our 470 points about 4 or 5 times over there!  What would be your priorities from that shopping list?  I think we’re in “Kid in a lolly shop” territory with this book right now.

I’ll have one of those…and one of those…and ten of those…

Woehammer Pete: I’d definitely lock in the second Croc in that case. Which leaves 150 points. My choice now would probably be more troops over characters at this point just to have a bit more presence on the table and a bit more protection for the Croc twins. 

Dave over on Woehammer would give me absolute grief if I didn’t mention Hobgrots… But I don’t see a place for them here. Good as screens, but for our list I don’t think one unit of Hobgrots is enough with their 6+ save.

Troops for 150 points doesn’t leave too many options:

• Boltboyz (110)
• Monsta-Killaz (120)
• Hobgrots (100)

Though thinking about it as I write this, a second Shaman could be more useful. Or possibly the Boltboyz just to give a little more ranged threat. 

But, like you said, having a second Shaman for the back up with manifestations….

You know what? I’m gonna be a coward and let you choose between those 😉

Plastic Pete: Ha! Motherfucker. Well I would struggle to take Hobgrots ahead of the others here. It’s almost a coin flip between the two but having ran the numbers on a minimum unit of Monsta Killaz, they can do quite a bit of work…so that’s why I reckon we don’t take them. Between the 20 Gutrippaz, two Crocs and two MKs we’ve got 5 hammer units of varying power, so I think we can afford the luxury of a second small shooting unit? One we can Sneaky Sneak up the board (and into harm’s way) without overcommitting. 

I’d love to have as many 20x Gutrippaz blocks as I do Crocs, but I think that “Boots on the Ground” list is one for another day. 

So this is how we’re shaping up:

Snatchaboss on Sludgeraker Beast (320)

– 1 x Killaboss with Stab-grot (130)

– 6 x Man-skewer Boltboyz (220)

– 3 x Man-skewer Boltboyz (110)

Snatchaboss on Sludgeraker Beast (320)

– 20 x Gutrippaz (340)

– 1 x Beast-skewer Killbow (160)

Swampcalla Shaman with Pot-grot (120)

– 7 x Kruleboyz Monsta-killaz (120)

– 7 x Kruleboyz Monsta-killaz (120)

1960/2000pts

3 drops

And now it’s my turn to put you on the spot! I have one last question on the army composition before we move onto the bells and whistles: Stick with the Killaboss, or bump him out for a second Shammy? Other than the tech both parties bring, if we go with the extra wizard, we’ll gain a CP (1950 points) but blow out to 4 drops. 

Tough question I reckon, and whatever you decide, remember that I’m enough of an asshole to blame you if it all goes to shit.

Woehammer Pete: Git! Hahaha. Well battle tactics wise, the Killaboss could increase the damage output of the Gutrippaz through buffs to help them delete a unit to complete the Kunnin’ Approach tactic. Whereas the Swampcalla doesn’t have any tactics they could have a direct affect on? We then keep the drops small(er) as well, though the extra CP would have been nice…

Screw it, you’ll blame me anyway 😉, let’s keep the Killaboss. Ideally we can play keep away with the Shaman.

So bells and whistles… I can’t see past Mork’s Eye Pebble on a Sludgeraker for the artefact. Being able to grant a 5+ Ward to all units wholly within 12” for an entire turn is tasty.

For the Heroic Trait I think if Sludgey the Sludgeraker is being accompanied by a load of Gutrippaz or Monsta Killaz then Egomaniak is a nice one. Though ideally you’d want to pass this off onto Hobgrots.

Otherwise Backstabba is a good one for minimum D3 mortals? Just not sure you’d ever have more than 2 units in combat with a target at once to get a bigger benefit with this list.

Plastic Pete: Funnily enough, Hobgrots are no longer the most efficient way of dumping off wounds. They cost 10 points per wound whereas Gutrippaz and Monsta Killaz are both around 8.5 ppw currently. So you can tell your mate Dave I said Hobgrots are so shit now, they’re not even good at dying. 

I don’t mind Slippery Skumbag so you can just Nope out of combat, and there’s an argument for Swamp Staff on our only Shaman to make him a crazy cheap Level 2 wizard (at +1 to cast).  Always one to consider carefully if you’ve only got the one wizard.

But ultimately I’m not going to argue against double defence on the Enhancements. Trait on one Croc, Artefact on the other? 

Now: Manifestations. Morbid Conjuration is the blue chip investment. You can just put your money in Morbid and watch it continuously tick upwards. So my question is, are we going blue chip with our Manis today, or are we going crypto?

Woehammer Pete: Manifestations. I mean, rather than blue chip, part of me wants to go with bonds and try to summon a Krondspine….. but yeah, Morbid probably should be the way to go. Better returns on your investment. Krondspine would rarely get cast on an 8+ anyway.

I actually don’t own those spells yet.

Plastic Pete: Yeah you’re not alone there – I know loads of people trying to find them on shelves right now.  To keep the finance banter going, being the proud owner of the core Endless Spells all painted up and ready to go feels like having a garden shed full of toilet paper back in the early Covid days.  The tricky part is that the unorthoodox base sizes make them hard to print or proxy – good luck kitbashing yourself an accurately-sized Gravetide.

Well our Wizards do cast at +1 so it’s about a 60:40 chance that we nail Krondspine first time… enemy Manifestations jamming up the board and zoning out our teleports would be a huge pest, so I actually don’t hate the idea of taking something dedicated to whacking them, especially zooming around with that 3D6 charge.  There’s also the fact that we’ve only got 1 cast in the list, so it’s not like we’ll be cracking all four Morbids onto the board with any regularity.  I like the idea of using your first spellcast or two to get this one out, and then once it’s on the board (and hard to get rid of), you switch to debuff spells or Not Mystic Shield.  What do you reckon – do you own a Krondspine?  

I’ve got Morbid and the Krondspine both ready to go, so I’m happy to be led by what you’ve got access to here.  Both are good options.

Woehammer Pete: I do own Spinedog. I’ve not built or painted him yet, so it’ll be a good excuse to get him finished (looking at the sprue gives me cold sweats). I think it’s more in-keeping with the Kruleboyz as well. So we’re there I think for our list? 

Tactics-wise, for the first game I’ll probably have one Croc with the Gutrippaz and Killaboss on foot, while the other is with the two sets of Monsta-killaz. 

The rest sits back and shoots what it can using Sneaky Sneakin’ to keep them away from the enemy, meanwhile praying you get the Spinedog roll off? Generally, piss off your opponent…

I’m looking forward to giving it a whirl. I’ve no doubt we’ll be comparing notes and making a few changes after a some test games? 

Plastic Pete: Well I was thinking it’s time to place the online recruitment ad for a Trophy Polisher (Full Time Position), with all the silverware we’ll be picking up.  

In terms of how I’ll be using the army, I see it similarly to yourself but with the asterisk that if the enemy has much in the way of Monsters, I’ll probably give each Croc its own little escort of Monsta Killaz to tilt the table our way. 

There is one more thing to tidy up in the list, and that’s aligning our Regiments with the GHB Season Rules.  Am I the only one who’s finding this part feels like a chore in 4th Ed by the way? 

We do like pissing off opponents denying Battle Tactics with this army, and we can make Slay the Entourage a bigger ask by putting only tough units in with our Bossman.  

Is it as simple as making the Sludgeraker with Egomaniak our General, putting the 20 Gutrippaz in that Regiment and keeping them nearby to one another?

Also – do you have a strong preference over which Honour Guard ability we’ll be using ourselves?  Those 6 Boltboyz will love Priority Target (the +1 to hit and wound applies to shooting too), and the 20 Gutrippaz give us a great option for that or the extra rend.  

It’s also true that the Boltboyz are a soft target for Slay the Entourage but we can often teleport them away from most threats, so I’m thinking we can play to our own strengths a little here with Egomaniak + 20 Rippaz + 6 Boltboyz in the General’s regiment? 

How does that sound – any other thoughts you had on Regiments? 

Woehammer Pete: I forgot all about Honour Guard. Think my head (like many others) is still stuck in 3rd edition!

I do like the idea of using Priority Target on the 6 Boltboyz, +1 to hit and wound rolls against enemy units in the General’s regiment is too tasty to pass up! While it would be good on the ‘Rippaz they can benefit from essentially the same through All-Out-Attack and the Killaboss buff for one turn.

I hard agree on the General’s Regiment. Sludgeraker with Egomaniak, the ‘Rippaz along with the Boltboyz would be a good shout. Like you said, using Sneaky Sneakin’ to play keep away is a good way of keeping them alive.

As for the other Regiments, just to make it more smooth-brained for little old me, I’d probably put the Killaz with the Shaman and the rest with the Croc. Annoyingly the Killbow won’t go with the Shaman.

On a side note, I’m loving the battle tactics this season, there’s no auto-completes there and a lot can be denied by your opponent if they plan ahead. Well done James Workshop.

Plastic Pete: Yeah that’s fair. Well I reckon this is where we’ve finished up:

We’re missing screens, but that comes with the turf when you’ve got two Crocs really. And unlike a lot of other armies (who’re also light on screens), we’ve at least got some workarounds: we have Wards, we have Debuffs (like -1 to hit and -1 attacks), and if necessary we can always just get the hell out of Dodge. 

I’m sure there’s room for refinement, but I’m looking forward to getting it on the table and reporting back 💪

Woehammer Pete: Aye, kill tally for the killbow next time …

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